Kohler shower head diverter

Kohler shower head diverter DEFAULT

Water coming out of shower head and spoutat the same time

Having vexed the fine people at Moen, I turn now to the collective wisdom of the B.V. Bulletin Board for thoughts on this problem.

A quick picture of the issue: New construction, 2nd floor, full bath. Brand new Moen Posi-Temp shower assembly. All copper pipes.

After installation (done by our plumbing subcontractor) turning on the water caused a steady stream of water to come out of the spout and a very steady flow from the shower head.

Plumber diagnosed that we had a water pressure problem. This was confirmed with use of a water pressure guage (90 psi). This problem was resolved with a pressure regulator. Now the house water pressure is about 50 psi.

Unfortunately, the shower problem persists. I spoke with the fine folks at Moen (we otherwise love their products) and confirmed that the distances from the valve to the spout and shower head were within the ranges for this product.

The Moen folks thought perhaps the cartridge for inside the valve was faulty. A replacement was sent and installed - stillsame problem.

Exasperated, the Moen folks suggested perhaps the pipe from the valve to the spout had a blockage of some sort. We removed the pipelooked insde with a flashlight, no blockages.

Any thoughts? Anything obvious we've missed.

In order to mitigate the problem, Moen sold us a very nice flow control valve for the shower head - this stop the water from coming out of the shower head, but there's still a trickle and frankly the flow coming out of the spout is not very strong (IMHO).

Sours: https://www.bobvila.com/posts/water-coming-out-of-shower-head-and-spout-at-the-same-time

Why Does My Faucet Keep Running When I Turn On My Shower?

Why does my tub keep running when I turn on my shower? It's because of your shower diverter valve! Learn more with this article.

Showering is something you do fairly frequently. You’re no stranger to stepping in the shower, turning on the faucet, and adjusting the taps to get the perfect water temperature. Nobody has to tell you how to stop the water from coming out the spigot and have it come out of the showerhead instead, right? Of course not! But have you ever thought about what forces the water to flow to your showerhead instead of the spigot? If you're like most homeowners, probably not.

If you’ve ever turned your shower on but noticed that there was still water running from the tub’s faucet, you may have wondered what was wrong with your shower. You’d probably be especially frustrated by the lack of pressure coming from your showerhead because it makes it difficult to shower properly. 

If your tub’s spigot continues to run even when you turn on your shower, you most likely have an old or faulty shower diverter valve. 

What is a Shower Diverter Valve?

Valves are everywhere in your plumbing. When you turn on your sink, garden hose, and tub, you are using valves. They even help determine your water temperature when you turn on the sink or shower.

A valve is what keeps the water from flowing through your faucet and sends it to your showerhead instead. Although you’ve probably never heard it called a "diverter valve," that is the part of your shower that you turn, push, or pull to send the water coming from your tub’s faucet to your showerhead. It does exactly what it’s named for: it diverts (changes direction) water from one place to another.

Learn how a shower diverter works before trying to fix your shower and tub running at the same time.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

The only problem with shower diverter valves is they don’t last forever, and there are many times—like all of the other components of your home—when they fail from old age and normal wear and tear.

There are two types of shower diverter valves:

Three-Valve Shower Diverter

Animated graphic of how a three-valve shower diverter works.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

A three-valve shower has three different handles that you turn to open or close the valves. One handle opens the hot water valve, one opens the cold water valve, and the third (generally in the middle of the temperature valves) diverts the water into the spigot or up to the shower head.

As you turn the valves for the hot and cold valves, depending on the temperature you want the water to be coming out of your spigot, you increase or decrease the opening of each valve. Once you get the right temperature, you can keep the water running into your tub, or twist the diverter valve degrees to divert the water up into the showerhead.

When water pours into the tub through the spigot, the valve is open. When the handle is turned degrees, the valve moves forward and a rubber washer plugs the spigot of the tub so no water can get through.

A diagram of the three-valve shower diverter shower.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

 Instead, the water is forced through a small number of holes in the valve which build pressure, sending the water up through the shower’s pipe and out of the showerhead.

The third valve diverter looks like this when it is working:

How the three-valve shower works to divert the water away from your tub spigot.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

Tub Spigot Diverter Shower

Your tub keeps running if your shower diverter isn't working.

There are a number of different ways this shower looks. Some showers have two handles that regulate temperature, which open the cold and hot water lines separately. The water mixes together before coming out of the spout. Other showers have one handle that opens both of the water lines, and depending on how far the handle is turned, determines how much each of the two water lines is opened and how hot or cold the water is by mixing the water temperatures. Either way, the diverter valve is generally found on the spigot of the tub.

Your tub keeps running if your shower diverter isn't working.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

This diverter valve is something you pull up or out to plug the water from coming into the spigot, diverting it up into the showerhead. When the diverter is pulled, it pulls a rubber (or sometimes plastic piece) into the hole where the water pours through, plugging spigot where the water normally flows. With this escape-route sealed off, the water has only one place to go: up and into the shower head. 

A tub spigot shower diverter diagram.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.
How the tub spigot diverter valve works.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

Why would my diverter not be working?

Although diverter valves are a fairly simple way to control whether or not water flows from the tub to the showerhead, if they break down and fail, they could cause other major problems in your bathroom.  There are a few reasons why your shower may either have water flow through both the tub’s spigot and the showerhead at the same time or not flow at all. If you find that you’re having problems with your showerhead and tub running at the same time or you can't divert water to the showerhead, you may need to have your diverter replaced.

(It’s important for us to mention that if you’re a home warranty customer, you won’t have to do any investigation into why your diverter valve isn’t working – in fact, if you try to investigate the problem yourself and fail, the repair may not even be covered by your home warranty! If you open a claim with your home warranty company right away, though, you could only have to pay a small service call fee.)

Here are some reasons why a diverter may be failing to bring water into a showerhead:

Blocked Diverter:

In both types of diverter valves, if there’s something that’s blocking the diverter from closing or opening all the way, it could cause water to pour out of both spigots at the same time.

If you have a spigot that has the diverter directly inside of the spigot, you can see if there is something that’s blocking the diverter from closing all the way. You may need to soak the faucet in vinegar overnight to soften calcium build-up or clean it out with a small soft brush.

What may be causing your tub's spigot to keep running even when you turn on the shower.
Download the shower diverter graphics here.

With the three-valve shower, if you can take the shower faucet off easily, you can try and open the valve and see if there are any blockages within the valve and brush them off with a clean cloth.

Broken Washer

Some diverters rely heavily on rubber or nylon washers to make sure the holes to the spigot are properly closed. If these washers crack, fall apart, or get bent, they could be the cause of the problem with the diverter. If you see a broken or cracked washer, this is something that will need to be replaced.


Sometimes the threads on the crew that connect the spout to the pipe can corrode. The spout’s finish could also flake off and cause blockages in the shower. If this is the case and the faucet isn’t replaced, it could cause water to leak out on the wall behind the shower, which could cause rot, mold, or mildew.

If corrosion or a broken washer is the cause of your diverter woes, you’ll probably need to replace the diverter valve. Not sure how to do that? Not to worry! We have an article on how to replace the diverter valve on your shower. 

Learn how to replace the shower diverter valve here.

Wait! Are You a Landmark Home Warranty Customer?

If you’re having problems with your diverter valve, listen up! Don’t take your shower apart to see if there’s a problem. If you have a home warranty and your shower diverter valve has failed from normal wear and tear, you can have everything fixed and paid for, for a small service call fee! If you try to do it yourself, then you may not have the repair or replacement covered. If you're not a home warranty customer and you have no interest in saving hundreds of dollars on home repairs like broken diverter valves, read our article on how to replace a shower diverter valve. 

Learn how to replace the shower diverter valve here.
Sours: https://www.landmarkhw.com/resources/plumbing/why-does-my-faucet-keep-running-when-i-turn-on-my-shower/2/8
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Author: SharonA (NJ)

The 3-way valve shower system will NOT WORK INDEPENDENTLY. The shower system dispenses water from all faucets (tub faucet, shower head, hand held shower). In A position shower head works. A/B, A/C and B/C positions the tub faucet hand held and shower heads work at the same time. Positions B and C DO NOT WORK AT ALL. B is the Hand held. C is the tub faucet.


(From Plbg.com staff)

Previously Sharon had written:

"The 3-way valve system will NOT WORK INDEPENDENTLY. The system dispenses water from all faucets (tub, shower head, hand held) when in the A, B and C positions. In A position tub and hand held work. A/B position tub and hand held work. In B position all three work. In B and C position the shower works only. In C position all three work but the shower head runs weak. In A/C all three but the shower runs weak."

Edited 2 times.

Post Reply

Author: bernabeu (SC)

soooo, if new - return it, if old - call a plumber

- - - -

Retired U.A. Local 1 &
"Measure Twice & Cut Once"

Post Reply

Author: North Carolina Plumber (NC)

Are we talking about a separate diverter valve ? Either the cartridge is incorrect or it was plumbed incorrectly.

Post Reply

Author: SharonA (NJ)

Yes there is a diverter that has been replaced twice to ensure no defect. Therefore, I agree, it has to be the plumber installed incorrectly. Something about a plug he was NOT suppose to remove. Unfortunately, even though he states he did not, this has to be the missing part causing this problem. The setup is simple to dissect to check his work except for this piece. It's in the wall. Very depressing!

Post Reply

Author: North Carolina Plumber (NC)

Is it a K ? None of the outlets are supposed to be plugged. Was the cartridge replaced ? While it's apart is a good time to check and see how it was plumbed. A bit of compressed air, or a water could be used to see what's going on.

Post Reply

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Kohler Shower valve diverter malfunction mystery

The Problem: Pulling the tub spout diverter up to engage the shower head results in a moderately loud vibrating noise and water is split between both outlets. Vibration is hard enough to rattle the pipes and can be heard throughout the house. Not as bad as a toilet water hammer though.

Long story short discovery: low water pressure at the shower valve causes the problem.

Question: What can I do to correct this problem - given all the solutions already tried (see below).

Longwinded background/info:

I recently remodeled () a standard 8x8 bath - call this the MAIN bath. Cast iron tub with Kohler KK valve and Forte Trim. Half inch copper supplies. The Forte shower head was replaced with a Water-Pik hand held shower handle. The previous valve was a Simmons, with diverter handle on the valve trim. This is the bathroom with the problem. It is on the nearest water line branch from the well tank.

In I remodeled another standard bath in this house - Call this the KIDS bath. Same specs: Cast iron tub with Kohler KK valve and Forte Trim. Half inch copper supplies. The Forte shower head was replaced with a Water-Pik hand held shower handle. The previous valve was a Simmons, with diverter handle on the valve trim. This bathroom does not have the problem. It is the furthest water line branch from well tank.

The problem happened in the MAIN bath right away. The problem does not happen in the KIDS bath.

Pressure observation: It seems that if the water pressure at the problem valve is below 30# when you try and engage the diverter the vibration problem happens. If the well tank is more on the fully charged side of things it doesn’t happen - works great. So it is just dumb luck whether you get in to shower and the well tank is near the kick-in point.

Pressure tests: Using a screw on pressure gauge on the threaded faucet on the Laundry sink (furthest fixture) I read Kick-in at 20# and Cut-out at 52# with the softener loop on. I get 25# - 50# with the filter by-pass on.
Using the same gauge at the well tank drain valve I get Kick-in at 42# and Cut-out at 62#. The well tank gauge reads 38# - 64#.
(A 5# drop through the softeners does not seem bad to me for a 15 year old system.)

Plumbing system: Starts on far left side of 34’ 2-story house with a well tank (Amtrol WX, 1” input, 1” output, 40/60 pressure valve), 90’s up and then double-Ts for Water Softener loop with shutoffs and by-pass, then T’s for ¾” line to tankless hot water coil on a Burnham boiler - and ¾” line to house for cold, 90’s to follow center girt with hot water line, first T up for 2nd floor MAIN bath, 4 feet later- T over for Kitchen, then near end of house- T up for 1st floor Half Bath, then at end of house 90s up to 2nd floor KIDS bath and Laundry Room. The Laundry Room slop sink is the furthest fixture on the line.

Things I have done:
o Called Kohler and they sent me out a new spout (free of charge). I’ve got 3 spouts, so they must have done that twice. No change - all 3 spouts.
o Got Kohler to send me a new Valve Kit and Pressure Control Unit (Again, no charge - great company). No change.
o On advice of my plumber, removed valve and pressure unit, closed the curtain, and turned the water on to blow out the pipes - in case there was any debris in the line. Thought this worked for a bit, but, no change.
o Cleaned (flushed) out the well tank of sediment.
o Replaced the pressure switch and gauge on the well tank.
o Tested the shower with the Kohler shower head instead of the hand held. No change.

I’m out of ideas. Does anyone know what may be going on here?


Sours: https://www.plumbingforums.com/threads/kohler-shower-valve-diverter-malfunction-mystery/

Diverter kohler shower head

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Part.1 Shower Diverter - Transfer valve installation step by step -- Moen, Delta, Kohler how to

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